Charlie Owen - The Myth of XBox 360 Fan Noise...?

The Myth of XBox 360 Fan Noise...?

In an email conversation with Seth Jayson (see this post) he mentioned one of the 'flies in the ointment' of the XBox 360 media capabilities (including Media Center Extender) compared to the announced Apple iTV was the 'sometimes loud fan in the XBox'.

I've been using the XBox 360 Media Center Extender for a couple of months now and the fan noise has never seemed overbearing to me or my family. I can see where an audiophile who wants absolute silence would not be overjoyed by the fan noise, but then again those folks will spend a lot more than $299 to fuel their quest for sonic perfection.

Curious, I borrowed a decibel meter this evening to see how loud the XBox 360 fans would become during normal use of the XBox 360 as a Media Center Extender. Unfortunately, the lowest measurement of the unit was 50db, making it less than ideal to measure the sound generated at a reasonable, normal distance from the unit (like 10'). According to this Wikipedia entry 50db is the equivalent of a 'quiet restaurant inside'.

Still, I thought the test would be interesting -- so I launched the Media Center Extender on the XBox 360 and kicked off a high definition recorded TV show (Law & Order, a favorite) and let it play for 30 minutes before taking measurements.

Anyone care to guess how close to the XBox 360 and where I had to put the meter to get it to register a continuous 50db...?

I guess you could say this is the audio equivalent of guessing how many M&Ms are in the jar. :-) Leave a comment with your guess.

Meanwhile, I'm going to track down a more sensitive decibel meter.

Categories: Media Center | Media Center Extender | XBox 360 | Comments [31] |

| Posted on Tuesday, September 19, 2006 5:19:50 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 6:15:16 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Hi Charlie,

I have two 360's set up as extenders and I think the noise is pretty distracting actually. It's better than the original Xbox, but I don't think by much. I remember reading a previous post by yourself mentioning that the fan noise was barely audible when running in extender mode. Having experienced the opposite, I have to say I was a little miffed at you as I had high expectations of low noise polution :) But then I recently read a comment on a different blog/article (can't remember which or which one) that some boxes were louder than others when sitting in dashboard or extender mode. The comment seemed to be saying that some boxes would spin up the fans to full speed even though it wasn't necessary. Have you heard any similar comments, or do you know anything about an issue like this? I bring it up, because I'd say I bought both my Xbox's fairly early on in the release and wondered if the issue might now be fixed?

At this point the noise in the living room (as opposed to the den) is bad enough that I'm pretty much waiting for a fanless second gen extender to swap out with the 360. Which is annoying, as I like all the other features you get with the 360 (marketplace, live, dvd, windows media connect, etc... oh, and games :) ).

Any info you have on a possible issue or resolution would be great.

Have any other readers heard of a similar issue?

Thanks, Ross.

Ross

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 7:22:43 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

I agree. While the noise isn't as bad as the hp media center pc it is connected to (at least that is in the closet), the fan noise is annoying and the wife acceptance factor just isn't there. When the Cox DVR which is horrible interface-wise can sit there - make no noise AND record in HD there is no way to win. I can argue pretty interface all day long but at the end of the day all she really cares about is it recording 1 soap opera a day and grey's anatomy (in HD) once a week - with no noise. And generally she wins.

Paolo

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 8:07:40 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

In my home the noise makes the 360 useless as a media player. That's very disappointing since this is one of the reasons I bought it.

So this is no myth to me!

And don't get me started on the DVD-ROM super noise when playing a game. I mostly play late with low sound volume, but the spinning DVD totally burries the game sound. So I's almost like muting the sound anyway.

Thumbs down for the noise on the 360! I wonder how the PS3 and the Wii will sound.

Jason

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 9:55:40 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Partly agree with the comments above. The fan noise isn't an issue for me but it may be less noticeable because my 360 is tucked away under the TV stand.

The DVD noise though is a joke and had I known it was that noisy before purchase I probably wouldn't have purchased the unit.

The other gripe is the lack of media playback capabilities or streaming. I have very few WMV files but a lot of AVI (mainly encoded with DivX/xVid) and Quicktime MOV which I just can't play.

Reitsy

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 12:22:11 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Ok, am I the only one here who think that 50 db is a LOT?

And I really think that a "quiet restaurant inside" would be very noisy? We are talking a small unit in my livingroom, is it fair that my livingroom should have the noise level of a full restaurant, even though it's quit to not notice the Xbox 360?

When we are talking Media Center PC's, a lot of OEM's aims (and runs) at around 20-30. I find it unacceptable that extender devices should be louder than our PC's.

I found a quote from three years ago, where Microsoft and HP defined what an acceptable PC noise would be:

----------------------
May 2003 Microsoft talk about "Athens"; a conceptual product in cooperation with Hewlett-Packard®:

"The negative effects of high acoustic emissions from PCs not only interfere with audio quality, they also can affect user productivity and even create potential health risks."

"The "Athens" PC design goal for acoustic emissions is 30 dB or less in A-weighted sound pressure (as defined in ISO 7779 and ISO 9296) while all components except the optical drive are operating."
----------------------

Regards,

Brian

Brian Binnerup

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 3:25:50 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Sorry to jump on the bandwagon here but I have to agree the 360 is louder than I would like it. I have it sitting on a shelf next to my TV and I need to find a new setup because it is very distracting when watching DVDs. I agree it's not AS bad when just using the extender but it is still extra noise. I am looking for a new setup to hide the 360 but not overheat it.

JonH

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 3:54:34 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

The measurement of 50db can be a lot -- but the decibel measurement itself means practically nothing without being paired with the distance measurement. A human breathing at 10' is measured at 10db (according to the wikipedia article) yet at 20' you can't hear them at all. Distance is an important measurement. Anyone care to guess how far away from the XBox 360 the meter had to be to get a measurement of 50db?

Charlie Owen

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 5:22:37 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Well, to be as loud as a restaurant I'd think it'd have to right up close; five centimetres?

I'm conflicted about the 360 noise levels. If I leave a game paused, the noise is horrendous. I was watching a film using the extender last night and I completely forgot it was making any noise at all. It's not ideal, but it's not unbearable.

Jonty

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 5:45:30 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Are you suggesting that after some "warmup" period the fan settles down? I don't think mine is 50db other than in-game, so I'd say 2 feet. Of course, that's assuming you're measuring from the front of the box.

Derek

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 8:26:45 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

From my experience the fan gets slightly louder after playing HD content for a while, owing to the stress on the CPUs. In other words, I waited until the fans were at their loudest before taking measurements -- not in an ideal, 'nothing is happening' state.

Charlie Owen

Tuesday, September 19, 2006 9:49:23 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Charlie, while you are in posession of the decibel meter, could you also post the sound level of your 360 while playing a DVD as a comparison?

MikeA

Wednesday, September 20, 2006 12:54:45 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

I have to agree with above comments. The 360 is loud. For bedroom purposes, useable only if you want to drown the fan noise with louder audio. I've owned xbox, DTV TiVO (dual tuner), Motorola MOXI Cable PVR, the 360 is the loudest. The MOXI semmed to scale the noise, becuase late at night the MOXI was louder than during normal viewing time. I also own two media centers pc's which are also quieter than the 360. The one major design flaw of the 360 is the noise. Definitely re-design. Otherwise great media center extender. DVD library and multiple codec support wouldn't hurt either.

Keith

Wednesday, September 20, 2006 4:54:40 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

So I just reread your original article Charlie, and I realise I never included a guess for how far away you have to be to get 50dB. But then I don't think I care. What's your goal with this experiment? To tell me that the noise output of your Xbox360 is 20dB at 10 feet away, and that therefore everyone talking about excessive fan noise must be nuts?

Fan noise is obviously subjective, but then maybe you also just got lucky and have a 'quiet' Xbox360? I saw Scoble interview you in your viewing room at Microsoft (which looked pretty cool to have at work by the way - tough life!). Any chance you could grab, say half-a-dozen, store-bought Xbox360s together in that room and measure their noise output during different functions (dashboard, extender, DVD, game, etc)? That would go a long way to maybe putting this issue to rest?

Okay, fine! 2 feet! :)

Cheers, Ross.

Ross

Thursday, September 21, 2006 4:38:07 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Ross -- right on...

Fan noise is subjective. What's loud for you may not be loud for me. What I am attempting to do is put some amount of objectivity on the subject -- so consumers can make some sort of informed decision before purchasing. If I can compare my subjective loudness threshold to some fairly well understood concept (like the sound of someone breathing or a jet engine) I have some idea of how soft or loud the piece of equipment is before I get in my home.

My goal is not to say folks are nuts. :-) Merely putting facts out there is the goal.

That's a good idea on using the listening room to do some wider tests. I'll have to figure out how to accomplish that task -- perhaps I can rope some fellow Microsofties to come in on a Saturday with their units -- to get some randomness -- rather than using 6 bought at the same time / same place.

So, I've got your estimate -- from where do you think I actually took the measurement?

Charlie Owen

Thursday, September 21, 2006 5:14:42 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Charlie, dude, you're killin' us - where'd you measure it from already :)

Ross

Friday, September 22, 2006 6:04:14 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

In order to get it to register 50db I had to place the meter behind the XBox 360 at a distance of approximately 6 inches.

Charlie Owen

Friday, September 22, 2006 10:07:40 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Was that 50db reading taken while a DVD was playing or just streaming video through a network?

Alex

Saturday, September 23, 2006 4:02:34 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Taken while playing (streaming) high definition video content on the XBox 360. Playing a DVD is quieter, at least on my unit. The fans don't rev up at all.

Charlie Owen

Sunday, September 24, 2006 7:43:19 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Maybe you've got a lucky 360. I'm particularly baffled by the not revving at all comment. My fans are never silent, under any circumstance, even just sitting at the Dashboard. (I've got one of the ones built in 2005, the ones that are probably defective anyway, so maybe newer ones are better.)

If I only listened to heavy metal, sure, but with classical music? Completely unacceptable.

Mike Kozlowski

Monday, September 25, 2006 12:50:06 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

I have no problem with the noise, but then my PC is also in the room and that drowns out the 360

Ian Dixon

Tuesday, September 26, 2006 4:01:03 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Wow - you get even less noise with the DVD!? I definitely get more noise when the DVD spins up.

So if we think we are getting excessive noise from our 360, do you reckon it would be covered by the recent announcement about free replacements/repairs for 2005 consoles?

Ross

Tuesday, September 26, 2006 7:02:04 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

Ross, unless you contact them you will never know. :-)

Charlie Owen

Wednesday, September 27, 2006 12:12:54 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

I have to say, all in all, I am disappointed by the sound levels of the 360. It seems just about every component is noisy; fans, DVD drive and even the hard disk!

It's such a shame as using it as a Media Center Extender is such a great, great idea.

Charlie - I hope you'll continue to blog about your experience with 360s and Media Center.

Simon

Monday, October 02, 2006 11:17:26 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

I think the fan noise from the xbox 360 is terrible !!!

I cant wait for the new Pica v2 extenders to be released next year as I will be selling my xbox 360 and replacing it with a new v2 extender - Why ? - NOISE !!!

Mark Carline

Sunday, October 22, 2006 11:46:05 PM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

XBOX360 is *LOUD*. I don't care about technical measurements - even if it's in the vicinity of 50dB, that's too loud. My projector is 26dB, and that is just about good enough. Anything above 30dB is a distraction in a movie setting.

Bottom line, the 360 just isn't cutting it as a media center extender. I'm throwing it out for media use as soon as the KISS DP1600 or similar Pika extenders hit the market. The 360 is a game machine, probably WAY overpowered to do simple MPEG2 decoding and GUI stuff. Unless MS figures out a way to slow down the CPU/GPU components while doing MCE, X360 is a nogo as far as MCE extending is concerned.

Stick to what you know, MS. Hifi/Home Cinema isn't one of them. MCE is a great "invention" (you were by no means first), but it works best with a silent extender and the pc stuffed away somewhere FAR, FAR from the TV.

Henning Kilset

Friday, October 27, 2006 2:22:35 AM (GMT Daylight Time, UTC+01:00)

SPL is not really a meaningful indication of noise. I'd suggest you read something about the topic before making any claims:

http://www.silentpcreview.com/article121-page1.html

For what it's worth, I think the xbox 360 is too loud. It's one of the biggest mistakes MSFT made in the implementation, IMO.

Anonymous Coward

Thursday, November 16, 2006 6:11:11 PM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)

Charlie,

I just got my 360 about a month ago (thanks, guys!). I haven't noticed any fan noise (with kids, cats, and wife, who notices fan noise?), BUT... the DVD drive sounds like a jet engine if its got a disk in there...

My son often leaves a disk in the drive when he powers it off. When I then bring up the Extender portion, the drive still spins at high speed even though we're not gaming. I usually have to get up, take the disk out, and find its case, as otherwise its too distracting in my otherwise noisy house.

Dana Cline

Saturday, December 02, 2006 2:12:08 AM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)

I purchased the Xbox 360 to be a Win Media Center extender only, we do not even own a game disk. With it’s loud fans it is not up to the job of being a true set top box. The 360 is much louder then a PC or the Tivo.

Any audible noise from a device in my family room or my home theater is too much noise. Remember for a true theater experience you do not want to hear any FANS during quite parts of a movie or TV show.

The fan noise is the worst when I start streaming any HD programming, the fans sound like a jet engine. The wife will NOT watch any TV if we are using the Xbox 360 to stream a pre-recorded show.

I was looking in to water cooling the Xbox 360 just to stop all the noise. A water cooling system cost as much as the Xbox 360 it self and requires a huge passive cooling tower.

In the bedroom we have a Linksys extender and there is NO noise from the box. It is a very quite unit, BUT it will not stream HD. The wife likes this box as an extender and uses it every day.

Please wake up to the fact that any audible fan noise is NOT acceptable if Microsoft want the xBox 360 to be a true set top box.

Greg

Thursday, December 07, 2006 3:42:19 PM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)

I’m a little miffed at this post. I think you’re too quick in dismissing the complaints over the excessive (in my opinion) noise of the xbox 360.

You state that only audiphiles care about complete silence and that you have to pay more than $299 to achieve that goal….well that’s completely false, a Tivo is silent, my $89 DVD player is silent, my audiotron (stereo connected mp3 player) is silent, and as someone else posted, their cable DVR is silent. I’m using those as a comparison because they all perform the same functions as the xbox…but silently. And there’s no reason why the xbox can do those same thing silently either. Does the xbox even need to have the fans moving at all when performing those functions? Can’t the CPU speed be scaled down so it doesn’t run as hot and thus making the fans unnecessary? If it can’t do any one those things, than there’s a problem in Redmond.

Now, I know that there can’t be any argument from you about how loud that damn DVD drive is and how loud the fans are during game playback. Some folks don’t care because they’re blasting their games, but I usually play Tiger Woods later in the night after my 20-month old daughter is asleep so I can’t be blaring the game…and it’s not a loud game anyway, and I definitely hear the xbox fans over the noise from the game.

opuntia

Wednesday, December 20, 2006 1:29:25 AM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)

how many people who have noisy xbox's have also managed to moved them while on? they make a nasty screeching noise when the floating disk bottms out dont they.

get it to where u bought it and get it replaced beofre its too late

deluckyirish

Thursday, March 01, 2007 6:50:00 PM (GMT Standard Time, UTC+00:00)

I just purchased an XBOX 360 purly for the extender capabilities, no games. It was a chore to get my wife to buy into the idea, but I promised it would be worth it. With the Vista release, there are no alternatives (without 3rd party software) compatible with Vista Media Center other than the XBOX according to Microsoft's website.

Vista works flawlessly with the new XBOX 360 as an extender. The graphics are great, HD, recording, etc. everything works as it should through the XBOX. The only problem is the fan noise on the XBOX 360, unbelievable. It's unrivaled as appliances go, and my wife is not too pleased with it. I found some articles about overcoming some of the DVD drive noise, are there any solutions to the loud fans?

Thanks,
Shane

Shane

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